Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:01 Hey everyone. And welcome to the more to life real estate investing podcast. I'm your host. And my name is Adrian Penoza. I'm a former police detective of 21 years turned real estate entrepreneur. Each episode we bring to you an incredible guest. Who's got undeniable experience in the real estate investing world to help you get more to life through the power of real estate investing. So if you enjoy listening to our podcast and our show, please, please don't forget to subscribe, rate and review our podcast. As it helped small podcasts like ours, continue to provide our audience with some incredible value and knowledge. So now let's get right into our next episode. Hey everyone, it's Adrian. Penoza here with the more to life real estate investing podcast, helping you get more to life. So you can start living your dreams through the power of real estate investing. Super, super excited today for episode number 39. Our guest today is Andrew Cigna. Andrew was born and raised in the construction world and began his career by becoming a master restorer with two CRC. How do you say that Andrew?
Speaker 1 00:01:27 I, I CRC. So it's like the designation. It's like Rico for real estate.
Speaker 0 00:01:33 Ah, okay, cool. At the young age of 19. Yeah. Andrew grew his passion by studying marketing at George Brown college in order to grow his family business. He began his journey into real estate investing in 2015 by purchasing a single family rental property. From there, Andrew Drew's portfolio quite aggressively to include many duplexes and residential properties in the Hamilton area. In addition to the two construction focused businesses, Andrew also runs a property management company with his brother, tons of experience here, guys. Tons of knowledge. And I should also mention, obviously Andrew's also a licensed realtor as well here in the GTA. So without further Duluth du <laugh> without further delay, welcome to the mortal life, uh, investing podcast show Andrew, how are you?
Speaker 1 00:02:28 I'm good, man. I'm good. I appreciate you having me on, uh, on your show. Almost hit the 40 episode. Um, but I'm assuming that that's gonna be a really, really banger. So, um, I'm gonna talk a little bit about what I'm kind of doing. Um, you know, cuz I I'm gonna assume that your, your audience is very, very, uh, real estate driven. Um, and where I started off was with a single family, then we converted it into a duplex and then we just kind of grew slowly. Um, and for me we thought that was the best a lot. We watched a lot of people aggressively grow their portfolio, which made us a little bit on the nervous side. Right. Um, when we started interest rates were 2.5 ish. So again, you started in 20 15, 20 15. Yeah. So we, we bought in Hamilton. This was when, you know, I bought that property and I remember signing the papers and my lawyer from Toronto goes, are you sure you wanna buy in Hamilton?
Speaker 1 00:03:25 He was questioning me. And I was like, yes, because I, I grew up in downtown Toronto in the junction and back in the day, ju the junction was rough. Um, yeah, it was really rough. And Barton had that same feel. Now it's taking a little bit longer than I anticipated, but you can see it changing storefronts are being, you know, have having renovations done to it. You could see the transformation happening, not as fast as I thought it would happen, but I saw it. Um, Paul saw it too, even, even me and Paul had conversations before signing that paper. Like you sure we wanna do it? We went above our budget. Cause our budget at that time was like 180,000. And we were like, okay, this one came up 2 25. I was a little nervous. I'm more of the conservative type when it comes to the money, I'm more on the, the, I don't wanna go past my budget, but Paul pushed me and pushed me in.
Speaker 1 00:04:15 Thank God he did because that one, you know, really started the, uh, the path to where we're at now. And we started with that property. And then we did, uh, another duplex conversion with a friend. Then we did, um, another one with a partner in Toronto. Then we got into multifamily and right now we have two, six plexes on the go and we don't go past our means because one when COVID hit, no one knew what was gonna happen to the market. Like I bought these two properties at the beginning of COVID and I was nervous. Right. So when I was presenting it to our partners, it's like, look, this is what I anticipated to go to. And then it was like, I think the one bedrooms will get us 1550. And then at the beginning of 20, 20, 15, 50 was a reach. That's a bit, right?
Speaker 1 00:05:00 Yeah. I was gonna say that's quite high. Yeah. Right now I think, I think one bedroom, 1550 is, you know, right on the mark, but two years ago, it wasn't mm-hmm <affirmative> and you know, these partners from Toronto, they, they, they came to look at the property and they were really, really rough. And one person, one of our partners walked in he's like, this is all yours and turned around and walked out. He's like, I'm going back to Toronto, I'm leaving you here to hammer. See you later. Um, but you know what? It turned out. It was a very difficult project. Um, doing cash for keys that was when cash for keys were about two, $3,000. My last cash for keys, I paid 10, 10 grand. Right? Like it was, it was doing that transition of increasing cash for keys because rent was going up.
Speaker 1 00:05:48 And, um, it was a very difficult project. We had a lot of people I'm very empathetic to the, the tenants, right. Especially when they have, uh, certain situations that they have to deal with and they have government assistance. So I work with their workers to find placements. I don't just go here's cash for keys. I offer my guys to help them move. Right. We do a little bit more above and beyond. I'm a big believer in karma. And I think karma comes back to you and I really do. So I'm not just like here's cash keys bugger off. So we helped some of 'em. We did cash keys. We helped them move. We, we worked with their workers to find placements. Um, now one's completely done and I'm really happy with that. That project went a little bit above budget. Uh, the other one I'm in, in the mix of doing it's taking a little bit longer, but I'm dealing with the city and the city is moving like molasses right at the moment. Oh, <laugh>
Speaker 0 00:06:44 You don't have to tell me that.
Speaker 1 00:06:46 I think you're familiar with that.
Speaker 0 00:06:47 There's some projects we've been waiting on our permits from the city, uh, for one excuse after another, but you know, six plus seven months.
Speaker 1 00:06:57 Oh yeah.
Speaker 0 00:06:58 Easy.
Speaker 1 00:06:59 Yeah. And you gotta count that in your carry guys. You're not swinging a hammer for 12 months. It, it hurts.
Speaker 0 00:07:06 <laugh> yep.
Speaker 1 00:07:06 It hurts. And you gotta account for stuff like that. Like it's human error, which never gets calculated into your spreadsheet. Right. It's it's really, really rare that people are like, oh, well here's a contingency. Well, do do people put in a contingency when they do their breakdown analyzing it properly? I don't think so. And maybe evaluate like maintenance and management at four or 5%. Is that really a true number? Do four or 5%? I don't think so. It inflation is killing it. Labor's high materials, high and maintenance is at 4%. Management's at 4%. There's no way. So when you, Eva, when I tell people and, and my clients that I tell them, when you evaluate it, make sure you put your own numbers in there. Don't just go what the seller's putting in there and what he's paying, because he could be the one that's self-managing it. Right. If 4% is not right. If you're gonna self-manage yeah. Put 4%. If, if, if you're gonna do it as a real full-time investor, you, you gotta count for more than 4%. So it's like, depending on the property, we're between 500 to a thousand bucks. There's no way that that's, that's sufficient to run a building. Right?
Speaker 0 00:08:19 Absolutely. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:08:21 No removal alone. Like what three, $400 a month. Sometimes, depending on how
Speaker 0 00:08:26 Many, depending on yeah. The size of the property or whatnot. But yeah. Let me ask you, what was it that made you decide real estate investing was the field you wanted to grow in?
Speaker 1 00:08:39 Um, the passion that I had to actually working with tenants. So I got into property management, uh, in 2018 and I already had a couple properties on the go and I, I enjoyed it. Um, I'm good at construction. I'm not passionate about it. Um, I'm better than most. I'm just not passionate about it. What I'm passionate about is working with clients and working and doing customer service. Um, and that kind of really hooked me into dealing with, with these type of properties, especially multi-families cause you deal so many is you start to build a relationship with these tenants. Like some of the tents that I have, I talk to regular, see how they're doing. You know, one gentleman, he was, um, came straight from India. He was terrified of Toronto, terrified. He was all by himself. He was international student and you could just see it in his face. He was nervous. I walked with him all along Spadina college bathrooms. I showed him some, some places to go eat just so he can get comfortable in the city. And that connection is fulfilling. Um, I found that to be really rewarding when you help people more than just providing housing, you providing people satisfaction. Right. And, and that was important to
Speaker 0 00:10:00 Me. You know, I've never heard that. Normally if I ask that question, why did you get involved in real estate investing 90% of the time people say, because I wanted freedom. I want, I wanted financial freedom, you know, time, freedom, et cetera, et cetera. I've never heard somebody actually say, um, what you just said, <inaudible> with you, which is, which speaks volume about your character and your personality. Actually, when you think about it,
Speaker 1 00:10:27 Well, you make all the money in the world, but if you're not fulfilled, you're not gonna be happy.
Speaker 0 00:10:31 Yeah. It doesn't matter. It doesn't, if
Speaker 1 00:10:33 You make 50,000 that you're the happiest person in the world compared to making 500,000 and you are miserable, is it worth it? I don't, I don't think so. The, the money is just the bonus. Just the gravy on top.
Speaker 0 00:10:46 Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:10:47 Right at the end of the day, if you don't like what you do, don't do it because there's a hundred different ways to make money. You can grow a business and make almost the same amount of net as you do in real estate investment. You just have the appreciated asset hold on for retirement. But if you have a business and you scale it and put in the systems, you can make the same net per month and then sell the business at the end of the day. It all depends on what you'll love and you gotta do it. Um, don't get me wrong. Not every tenant is always easy to deal with. And sometimes you wanna pull out your hair, but the ones that you do connect with it's, it's very rewarding.
Speaker 0 00:11:22 Nice. So approximately eight months ago, or so give or take you been self-proclaimed as a self-employed through above all real estate business. Congratulations on that. By the way. <laugh> what is the above all real estate and how does, how did this opportunity evolve?
Speaker 1 00:11:43 So it's actually funny because we had NFBA construction group and, and we were coming up with names because we were getting into more focused on real estate. Um, and we didn't know what name to come up with. And my parents' first company was called above all. And it was very, um, important to my mom, that name because it actually taught me and Paul a lot that, that business, it taught us. We went through the recession of oh eight through it. It was very difficult, but it taught us a lot because we had a lot of hard times and those hard times actually teaches you how to be good during hard times. And that name stuck with us. And that's why we actually named the company above all. And we now have above all property management above all real estate, above all landmarks, um, and, uh, and above all group, which runs the entire group of companies. And it is something that I'm very happy with. And we actually did. We actually grew these businesses to be more vertically integrated, to add more value to our clients' partners and investors. Right. Because we were hiring property managers and they weren't great. We were hiring contractors. They were giving us a run from our money, you know, mm-hmm <affirmative> you could hire a contract, he's gone. Mm-hmm <affirmative> right. Yeah. You giving a deposit. You're worried that he's coming back the next day.
Speaker 0 00:13:08 Yep.
Speaker 1 00:13:08 Right. Like that's, that is it's, it's hard. So we, we wanted to get vertically integrated where we can be self-sufficient and run a project. If something were to fall, we could pick up the pieces to make it happen.
Speaker 0 00:13:22 So, you know, very similar, similar to my kind of strategy or my group of, uh, companies that we have, um, essentially an in-house construction company slash pick up the pieces and, you know, and, and take the project to where it may need to go basically. Is that what you're saying?
Speaker 1 00:13:41 A hundred percent. We, we are basically from start to finish, like I just got my mortgage license. I'm not planning on being a mortgage broker. I'm just adding value to my partners and investors. Right, right. It's I'm not gonna be out there, you know, pushing to be a mortgage broker. It just adds more value. Um, and I think at the end of the day, that's how any good business runs and operates and becomes successful is adds the most value to their client partners or investors.
Speaker 0 00:14:08 Absolutely. So where do you see the above all real estate business going the next couple of years?
Speaker 1 00:14:14 Uh, we're actually getting it to development.
Speaker 0 00:14:16 Oh, nice.
Speaker 1 00:14:17 Right. So, uh, we're, we're really pushing for that. Um, purpose built is really appealing to us. Some of the, some of the new technology that's in construction is very appealing. Um, it's something that intrigues and I think that's gonna be the future, especially for Canada is energy efficiency for purpose built buildings is gonna be something big in Canada. So like lead lead is a very big organization. And, and I think those, those organizations need to lead the way because we do need to make changes. Um, and I know the bigger organizations are, are headed down that path and you might as well go down that same path as well.
Speaker 0 00:15:07 Nice. Good for you. That's that's huge. Yeah. That's huge. So getting back to your portfolio, Andrew, uh, cuz obviously it's, it's, uh, it's an eye opener for novice investors out there listening to our show and what you've been able to achieve since you've started. But, um, can you, can you tell us, are you still, obviously you're still active in growing your portfolio. We just talked about you're getting into development and stuff like that, but at the moment, give us a, give us a rundown on your portfolio and basically, you know, some of the, I guess, challenges that, uh, you navigated growing this portfolio since 2015.
Speaker 1 00:15:50 Yeah. So we, we are at about 22 doors, um, with great partners. Mm-hmm <affirmative> we got majority of them at the beginning of 2020. I was shopping and looking and hunting in between then and now. But the numbers didn't make sense and I wasn't gonna buy something. One where my partners didn't feel comfortable, two just to buy. And I'm glad we didn't because now with the interest rates going up, we would be in a very, very sticky situation. And if numbers don't make sense, don't buy it. You gotta account for interest rates to go up, go down. It, it like real estate's like the stock market never stays the same. It never stays the same. Right. So we, we grew slowly, which we are, I am very happy. We did. We have a good foundation now, now we're ready to kind of really aggressively grow our portfolio.
Speaker 0 00:16:47 Nice.
Speaker 1 00:16:48 Right. So now with, with interest rates going up, purchase prices are gonna be going down and that's where you gotta be, you know, skilled in negotiations to, to get the property, to make sense.
Speaker 0 00:17:05 Absolutely. Have a skilled joint venture partner or have a very skilled realtor. Yeah. Uh, that specializes, you know, for everybody listening. I, I, I can't and nothing against just normal realtors out there that perform just regular, you know, single family transactions or, or, or whatnot. Everybody has their expertise, but I can't stress enough. Like why would you, if you're, especially if you're a novice realtor, if you know, you've been, you know, ain't your first rodeo, you've done this so many times then just grab anybody you want. Sure. Fine. But if you're a novice and it's one of your first acquisitions and whatnot, and you're not joint venting, you're doing it on your own. Why would you work with a realtor who, you know, he's never really been in that space and, and take his advice or if he has any advice for that matter. But it's like saying I wanna buy a Cadillac, but I'm going to a Honda dealership and they know nothing about Cadillacs.
Speaker 0 00:18:02 They'll sell you the car, they'll sell you the car so they can make, you know, they can put bread on the table so to speak, but they don't know Cadillacs. They sell Hondas. So why would you do that on one of the biggest investments of your life? Yeah. It always just shake my head thinking like it makes zero zero sense and people still do it because you know, some of the properties I list and I'm getting calls from other agents that they're representing a client on an offer this or that within three minutes, I can tell if this guy typically works in the multi-family space or he's just a guy who I got my real estate license and I got this client handed to me and I'm just, you know, you could tell right away. And I just and said, I just kind of shake my head thing and wow. You're way outta your league here, pal. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:18:49 Most people hire, you know, uncle Vinny or cousin Paul.
Speaker 0 00:18:53 Yeah. And then they don't have a clue because they wanna do the guy favor. But in the end it's like, oh,
Speaker 1 00:18:57 It's not doing them justice. And, and what I, what I tell people is ask them what, ask the realtor, what their portfolio is.
Speaker 0 00:19:07 Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 00:19:08 Like I wanna see what your portfolio, what have you done if you're an investor focused realtor, show me what your, your portfolio looks like.
Speaker 0 00:19:15 Yep.
Speaker 1 00:19:16 Not a lot of them have it. Good chunk of them do. Some of them are very good, but there's not as many out there as they proclaim to be. They, it is just not. And the one thing that bugs me in which I tell clients is it all comes down to negotiations when it comes to buying multifamily. And if you have a realtor that is pushing back to not insult the other side, because they think that the number that you're suggesting is too low, that's not the realtor for you. Numbers need to make sense for your side and they need to be okay with offering it. Cause I hear a lot of stories with investors that their agent didn't wanna submit the offer or gave them pushback because they thought the number was too low and they didn't want offend the other side, offend them because the numbers are the numbers. They don't lie.
Speaker 0 00:20:05 Right? Yep.
Speaker 1 00:20:07 Numbers, numbers. Right. So at the end of the day, if the numbers don't make sense for you, but every, every numbers don't lie, but it also needs to make sense for you because sh guys, they buy a 2% cap rate, like for appreciation, that's the, they have to be losing money, right? Like big corporations buy a 2%, they lose money on a monthly basis, but they make the money on the appreciation
Speaker 0 00:20:33 They want. It's kinda like a balance. Yeah. It's kinda like a trade off. Right,
Speaker 1 00:20:37 Exactly. Right. So people are like, oh, I wanna buy it at a four cap. It's like, okay, for cap, that's fantastic. But like where, where let's, it's on a per property basis. It's not like, oh, cap this or door. That it's really, what if it's a four cap, but you need to spend a million dollars in renovations. <laugh> right. I was looking at a property and I was like, we need to spend 250,000 just to be able to be say, it's structurally sound to walk in and work.
Speaker 0 00:21:09 Wow.
Speaker 1 00:21:09 Right. There's, there's some properties. It's like, it all depends on what you have to put your down payment and purchasing it's. Yeah. That's fine. And dandy. But if you go and you're like, I gotta spend 200,000 just for structural. It's not worth it. And you see, what I love is when they're like, oh yeah, freshly renovated, you go in there. You're like, this is not freshly renovated. It's new stuff, but it's not done by skilled people. This is all gotta be ripped out and redone because for us, I, I know your units and I know you've probably seen it to where you walk into a freshly renovated unit and you're like, this all needs to be ripped out and redone.
Speaker 0 00:21:46 Mm-hmm
Speaker 1 00:21:47 <affirmative> this is not to our standard. I wouldn't put a tenant in this.
Speaker 0 00:21:52 That was my, that was my scenario. Before we started our own company. <laugh> when, excuse me, we were just working with joint venture partners and not joint venture partners, contractors, joint, uh, general contractors. When I first started, uh, renovations and I, the first one, the first bur I did on a re project, there was no joint venture partners. It was just mine. Uh, probably did like two or three without any JV partners. And I just hired GCs. And again, we're talking, I don't know, eight years ago or so eight, nine years ago. And yeah, like there was stuff that you walked in and you are, you, are you kidding me right now? Like, that's the level of quality that you're leaving this at, but that's a whole other ball of wax, but, and, and you can do a show just on renovations and dealing with, in dealing with, uh, general contractors for that matter.
Speaker 0 00:22:47 Oh. Cause there's all kinds of stories, you know, I'm, I'm sure you and I both can tell based on our, our experience with them. Right. But let's talk a little bit about, um, flipping you've obviously been in that space before. Um, flipping homes obviously has a common method for investors to learn how to do it, earn and feel satisfied in the real estate industry, but to succeed on a big scale in the world of flipping real estate, obviously has a little bit of an expertise and more of an understanding. Yeah. What are some of the over or underestimations that people make when a flipping opportunity presents itself?
Speaker 1 00:23:33 They always, they, this is always, this is number one. They always under evaluate the construction always.
Speaker 0 00:23:41 Right.
Speaker 1 00:23:42 They never put a contingency to it. They, they always go, yeah. It's about 75 that break down that construction cost. Like what we do is we break it down to masonry flooring, structural details of structural. And you have to go on what current material is at. Because past two years, lumber has been like this opt down, opt down, you will buy a two by four for 10 bucks. And you're redoing a basement that adds a lot to your budget. Right. But if you buy it at five, it decreases your budget. So people need to really be sticky on the construction pricing. And when they do get quotes, get a few, but don't always go with someone, you know, because it can ruin a relationship because sometimes it gets sticky. What we do with flipping is I've done some single families and I've done some conversions and the more lucrative one and the more satisfying one is the conversions, the single family always have to be like, do you think this person would like this?
Speaker 1 00:24:48 You know, you're more on the design factor. Yeah. Conversions. It's like, make it look nice, make it but built well. So it lasts long. So the life expectancy of the bathroom is gonna be a lot longer. You know, you put cement board instead of blue drywall, you do, um, vitro right on the plywood. It's stuff like that, that you want to build for the investor. That's gonna buy the duplex or Plex. So then they're like, yeah, I bought a good property. You know, I want to sell a good product. And as a flipper, that's what you're doing. Cause you're selling a product and we go above and beyond on our flips because I, the end of the day that person's like, yeah, I bought this, but it was done properly.
Speaker 0 00:25:29 Mm-hmm <affirmative> mm-hmm <affirmative> yeah, for sure. Great advice. You know what I try to do? I try to inflate what I think if I think res are gonna be, I'll just put it out there. Res are gonna be 50. I'll put it down at 75 or 80. Yeah. Like I like that cushion there. Um, just for peace of mind, because obviously when you're working with business partners, joint venture partners, um, you know, they're relying on your expertise, they're relying on what you're telling them. They're relying on budgets. And obviously we all know it's important to come in on budget. Um, so how does that saying go, uh, um, under promise over deliver. Yeah. Is something that we like to thrive and live by, um, under promise over deliver, and you look like a rock star as opposed to over promise and under deliver. And then they're scratching, head thinking, wow. How did we get this wrong with these numbers? You know? And obviously that's gonna just play to your reputation as well. Yeah. And, uh,
Speaker 1 00:26:41 Is if people, the other big thing is over renovating
Speaker 0 00:26:45 Or over renovating.
Speaker 1 00:26:46 Yeah. When you over renovate, like you gotta also think about what you are gonna be putting in as your finishes. Like, are you putting in a luxury kitchen in, in east Hamilton? No, probably not. Right, right. We did one, one flip where we over renovated way too much. We didn't lose money, but we didn't make money. And it was just like, okay, we wasted eight months. And it was like, what did we do here? We, we made like two or 3000 bucks. If we're lucky you account for your variable cost of going there, there's no way. But at the end of the day, you're like, I just wasted eight months doing this project. Cause I over renovated. Right. You made it look beautiful. Yes. The end product is beautiful. You're also doing stuff to, to generate revenue and you just wasted. That's basically a working like eight months for free.
Speaker 1 00:27:38 Yeah. Bingo. Right. Yeah. And just, that's the one thing that people need to be careful of is even, even us that are familiar with construction, it's easy to make a mistake in construction. You're like, oh God, I didn't realize how much this went up. Especially with the era of COVID. Right. <laugh> the era of COVID made, made people really kind of, I think it made them better because people needed to think about the step ahead. The step ahead. It's like, oh, is this gonna be in supply? I got, I got flooring that needs to go in. I can't buy it in a week. I gotta buy it two weeks ago, three weeks ago to make sure it's on site, ready for the contractor to install it.
Speaker 0 00:28:22 Right.
Speaker 1 00:28:23 Right. It's just, you don't know who has what inventory is. Not what it like, what it used to be. It's like when you went into a supplier and they had everything in stock ready to go for you to pick up and walk out the door with, it's not like that anymore.
Speaker 0 00:28:39 Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:28:40 Right.
Speaker 0 00:28:42 As we get close to the end here, or just about, uh, 30 minutes or so, um, Andrew, what is your, why, why do you do what you do?
Speaker 1 00:28:52 It's actually funny that you asked me that. Cause I had a meeting with my broker, uh, a broker of record and he's like, we were talking about strateg. He's like, we don't need to talk about strategies. You know what you're doing? He goes, why are you doing it?
Speaker 0 00:29:06 Mm-hmm
Speaker 1 00:29:06 <affirmative> sat back. I'm like, well, I don't really know. I'm like, I love what I do. So I don't really know my why. And I think I would like to save freedom, but I already have that freedom. I do what I want. Like how I want it. I work the way I work because I have that freedom. Right. I think what my, why is, is for personal growth and development and to give back. And I think that I heard, I heard a quote, um, I don't know it exactly off by heart, but giving back is actually the most rewarding thing you could do because the more you give back, it's actually more of a selfish thing when you give, because it gives you satisfaction. And that's where I'm actually, my mindset is going and I've taken the past few weekends to kind of really evaluate and my why is to make other people happy and make the people around me as happy as possible. I'm not always perfect about it, but that's what I try for.
Speaker 0 00:30:00 Amazing. Yeah. That speaks volumes to, uh, your character. For sure. I've never heard that, that one yet. And I try to ask everybody on the show. That same question. So yeah. Cools to you. Awesome. So, um, you're very successful now obviously, and we say that relative to how the world views success, but do you think there's still more to life for Andrew and when you picture more to life, what do you see?
Speaker 1 00:30:29 I actually like this goes back to the conversation with my broker and I would take rarely take time off. I was always chatting with tenants and what more to life for me is being a little bit free. And what I mean free is not free to do what I want is just free with peace of mind. Like I don't have worries. I don't have, you know, regret. I'm like Gary V says that 400 trillion to one because we became a human. We gotta be grateful for that. And that's where it's like, I'm free. Like I recently got a motorcycle and my mind is absolutely clear when I'm on my bike. There's nothing else in the world. Nothing matters one, cuz I don't wanna have an accident two. Cause you know, you're just enjoying life. You're just hearing the wind. And for me that is, that is free.
Speaker 0 00:31:23 Awesome. Awesome. Well Andrew, how do people out there get a hold of you? Obviously a ton of knowledge in the multi-family space, the construction world, and now starting to embark on developments and stuff like that. You obviously know how to run numbers so on and so forth. And you're a realtor as well. Um, how do people get a hold of you?
Speaker 1 00:31:45 Yeah, they, they could hit me up on Instagram at Andrew J dot C. I GN a and uh, yeah, you can just shoot me a message there. That's probably the fastest way to get a response.
Speaker 0 00:31:57 Awesome. Awesome. Well, listen, I want to thank you so much for being a guest on the more to life real estate investing show. Uh, it's been a great 30 just over 30 minutes now and uh, I think some, uh, some great content here that people can get from it and enjoy the weekend. My friend, it is Friday and uh, it's actually beautiful out here where I am, but I heard it's. Are you in Hamilton now? Uh, yeah. Well I'm actually in Branford
Speaker 1 00:32:24 Right at the moment, but it is nice. It was pouring rain earlier today
Speaker 0 00:32:28 And I heard it was raining out there. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:32:30 Yeah. So I'm actually gonna go bring the bike out right now.
Speaker 0 00:32:33 Kind of
Speaker 1 00:32:34 Bug her off for a whip. Yeah.
Speaker 0 00:32:36 All right, Paul. Well, cheers. Thanks so much and enjoy your weekend. All
Speaker 1 00:32:40 Right, man. You too.
